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Can you explain how you understand mastermind groups? How do they actually operate? What kind of value and things are people getting out of these

opportunities? In general, it’s law firms coming together, sharing information, helping each other. There’s only two ways that law firms make more

money. One is they hire you, right? And you increase the number of cases that come into the law firm. There’s no

secret sauce to being successful in what we do. The reality is it’s not your IQ.

It’s not your EQ. It’s really how hard do you work.

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[Music]

Welcome back to the John and Mark podcast. We’re here today with the one and only heavy hitter Rob Lavine. We’re actually in Chicago for Rob Lavine’s

mastermind group, which we just got done with day one downstairs. Rob, thanks so much for joining us.

Absolutely. My pleasure. Thanks for having me. I appreciate it.

What we’re going to talk about today is mastermind groups and learning from others, right? Being competitors, but still learning and common misconceptions

of mastermind groups, things people have learned in mastermind groups. So, having run a mastermind group of your own, let’s start with this. Why did you choose to start a mastermind group?

So, the truth is probably about giving back. I joined my first mastermind group, let’s see, I’ve been a lawyer for

25 years. So, it’s got to be close to 20 years, probably 5 years in. So, I’ve been literally consistently in mastermind groups for 20 years. And I

can say without a doubt, I would not be where I am if it wasn’t for being in a mastermind group. Right. I was very

lucky when I first started out. I was friends with Paul Harding from Harding Mazati and he was in a very large group,

one that I probably had no business being in at the time. We were small, low revenue. And he talked the director,

“Hey, let Rob in.” He’s like, “Oh, well, we have smaller groups you can go in.” And Paul’s like, “No, we’re friends. I want him to be with me and you should

let him in.” And so then I was surrounded by really smart people like Jan Dills and Paul George Sink like really large Jim Adler.

Big firms.

Yes, big firms. And I have like this little guy and I’m like wow. Surrounded by these monsters. And uh I think it was

my first mastermind group. I went on a sunset cruise and I met Jim Adler. You know Jim of course, right? And so he’s

just talking to me like, you know, and I’m thinking, this guy’s been practicing law 2 years longer than I’ve been alive

and, you know, a monster firm. And yeah, just everybody was so welcoming and sharing. And I decided, you know, we’ve

grown a lot obviously. And I thought I’d like to have my own group and help people and and do for others as

people did for me. Do you remember like the did you have like a moment where like hey I need to join a masterminding group like I need to get advice from others. Was there like a breaking point

to remember or was did you get recruited in and someone was like hey you at the point now you should probably join one of these things. Yeah so I never worked for anyone else.

I graduated from law school and I really had two jobs. I was in-house counsel to a plumbing and heating company and then started my own firm at the same time.

And you know, I used to call people constantly with questions, right? You hang a shingle. Like, they don’t teach you how to run a law firm, right? In law

school, they teach you how to practice law barely. And along the way, I met people who were in mastermind groups. I heard about it and I just got tired of trying to figure everything out. And I

thought, I should join a group. And Paul’s like, “Oh, I’m in this group. I can get you in.” And so went from there.

What is that process of getting into a mastermind group? Because there is you can’t just say, “Hey, I went in.” Right.

Right. That’s a great question and it depends on the group. So my group I have all differentiz law firms combined

together. Some groups like the one that I joined, I’m surprised they let me in, but they really only let me in because of my friendship with Paul because they

were all really top tier law firms, big certain amount of revenue. So qualifying a lot of times is based on your size,

based on your revenue. Also, some law firms believe that it has to be specific to your territory. So there’s no overlap in DMA. Every mastermind is different,

right, as far as what they allow, right, into a group. Some of it’s an interview.

Like there’s a lot of different processes. A mastermind group can mean a lot of different things to a lot of different people. For someone who hasn’t attended one before or who was a membere

of a mastermind group, can you explain how you understand mastermind groups?

How do they actually operate? What kind of value and things are people getting out of these opportunities? There are definitely very different formats,

right, for a mastermind group. In most mastermind groups, there’s a facilitator, right? Usually the person

who runs it and owns the group. And then presentations are done by the members.

So you go, they’re usually twice a year, some are three times a year in person, right? There’s very little followup in

between those meetings. And then the people who are members get up and do a presentation. And so the problem with

that in my opinion is that you have some people who are great at teaching and presenting. And let’s be honest, some

people just suck at it. And so you never really know what you’re going to get.

And it’s it’s not in my opinion that’s not the greatest format. And the bigger problem is that you know when you go to

a seminar and you’re a busy at work to be able to take some piece of information from the seminar and then

bring it back to work and execute on it and be able to get it up and running and going until you meet with your group

again 6 months later. That’s hard, right? So we have a very different format than that. So, but I mean it

really depends on what you want and what you’re looking for. So, I would say if you’re looking for a mastermind group, you got to see different formats and see what you like. But what is it in

general? In general, it’s law firms coming together, sharing information, helping each other. Some law firms bring

in professional presenters. Some don’t never allow presenters in. Some let vendors in and they’re selling to them all the time. It’s just kind of it’s

different in every group. who attends your group and do you think that that is homogeneous across all groups like your

yours we were at it today I saw marketers there and I saw law firm partners there actual attorneys like who

else attends and how does that compare to others so some groups only allow one person to come to the meeting and that

would be the owner we’re like I said a totally different format so often you’ll see in my groups you’ll see the owner

come you’ll see the COO come and you’ll see the CMO come. Those are usually the the three people. Today, one owner came

and he brought two of his top tier attorneys because of the stuff that we were talking about. He wanted them exposed to it. So, it’s different. I

don’t I it’s un you can bring as many people as you want. I just have a a different theory of how to create that

education and learning and people to facilitate what we do and bring it into their firm. I think it makes more sense to have more leaders present. Yeah, I

think that’s a good strategy because one of the things you brought up earlier, I think one of the biggest challenges is probably getting really good pieces and nuggets of information, but then like

how do you implement that change in your firm as just one person taking that having to relay that information and implement it while doing your job is like a humongous task.

100%. So, we have weekly meetings. So, we meet every Thursday at 3 p.m. and Zoom. And so, two of the meetings a

month are breakout rooms by subject matter expert. So I have in one room is our intake expert, in one room is our marketing director, in one room is our

operations expert. And so depending on what you’re specifically working on, you can go in that room and ask questions, get help, focus. The other people in

that room all help each other. So it really is a great way to continue the conversation. Our staff had dealt with this before because they know I’m like

really big going to a conference to learn something or I’m reading a book that there’s like call like whiplash that I learn something new then I come back excited and they have to implement

it all. So the staff for the mastermind group is probably like anxiously waiting for everyone to come back on Thursday with a laundry list of things they got to change.

Got Colin sick. Colin sick. Mark’s Mark’s coming back.

I’ll have your favorite today in the room. I can see like certain people like messaging their team when someone would say something on Slack or in an email and I was like they screenshot it and

set it up. I was like, “Okay, someone’s already getting actual items of things they have to do back home.” I used to do that when I used to go to mastermind groups. I’d be texting my COO

saying, “Oh my god, this is a great idea. Oh my god, we need to do this picture of the screen. Oh my god, we need to implement that.” I don’t do that

anymore. But yes, mastermind groups have firms participating, sharing information

about what works at their firm and applying it to what could work for other firms, right? Like overall that’s the intent.

I would say yes. At what point, and it would be great if you had an example of this, have you seen someone go beyond

the this is what we should share and they start sharing whether it’s like insider things that like only worked at their firm that don’t make sense or

maybe it’s something that like is just information that is proprietary and should have stayed at the firm. Give us one of those stories of someone like

went way too far and shouldn’t have shared. I mean, so it depends on the group, right? I’ve belonged to lots of mastermind groups over the years and it

depends on the group. Like some groups like share their numbers like their revenue, their expenses. That’s okay.

Like it is encouraged like this is how much money we brought in. This is how many cases we signed. In my group, no.

So, and my group, we’re not DMA specific. So, I have several people in Texas that are in the same DMA. Several

people in Los Angeles that are in the same DMA. So, I don’t ever ask people to share their numbers. That’s pretty private, right? And you don’t

necessarily feel comfortable sharing that with the person who has a firm maybe down the street. But other than that, they all share. I mean, the

reality is there’s no secret sauce to being successful in what we do. Like, there just isn’t. It’s not your IQ. It’s

not your EQ, right? It’s it’s really how hard do you work? What’s the effort that you make? and do you put things in place? We all have the same case

management systems. We all run cases the same way. We’re all generally doing marketing the same way. You have the group that does traditional, so their

TV, their radio, their billboards. You have people doing digital LSA, pay-per-click, now the whole thing you’re talking about with AI and SEO.

Everybody’s doing some of it, right? So, the question is how well are you doing it, right? And people seem happy to help each other. I talk to people that are

interested. And so right we have a sales team obviously right so I don’t only have a mastermind group but so under the Rob Lavine legal solutions umbrella we have a medical record retrieval company

a staffing company and their mastermind group so the sales people meet people I don’t have to meet anyone that’s interested in record retrieval or

staffing but if someone wants to be in the mastermind group then I interview them personally you can tell in that conversation that somebody’s just not

interested in sharing and they’re I just this probably not a good fit for you is what I would tell someone as someone who’s grown like pretty large

for a firm you guys are are keep expanding. What is your mindset on like competition? Are you really competing against your neighbor firm or is there

plenty like a blue ocean out there for you to grow?

So my honest answer is I think our number one competitor not just me but any personal injury law firm is the insurance company right? So that is our

number. Well, if you think about the number of cases we sign for clients compared to the number of cases

insurance companies settle directly that aren’t represented by an attorney. It’s a joke. We’re like tiny, right? Because number one, they’re allowed to make an

inerson solicitation. So imagine you get in a car accident, you call your insurance company and report it. The first thing they do is they call the

other driver and say, “Oh, Mr. Smith, I’m so sorry to hear that you’re in an accident. I’m sorry that our client rear ended you. Are you okay? Because they

want to get on record you saying, “Oh, no. I’m okay.” Because now they have a recording of that, right? And so they’ll send somebody out to your house. We can come out to your house and appraise your

car and we can write you a check for the amount of damage that was to your car.

And while the adjuster is there, he can say, “Oh, by the way, did you say you weren’t injured?” “No, I’m not injured.” “Well, we’d like to take care of your personal injury claim and I can give you

a separate check for your bodily injury claim while I’m here if you’d like. sign this release and you’re done on both cases without ever having thought about

it or talked to a lawyer. That’s our number one competitor.

Didn’t even think about that way. That’s a very good point.

I did not think about it that way. That is very interesting. So, you think that’s the overwhelming major or you know that’s the overwhelming majority of cases?

Oh, 100%. Absolutely. That’s crazy. It It’s interesting. We did a podcast with Cassidy Lewis and she said her biggest

challenge is not marketing to her like client base. that’s going to sign up.

It’s marketing to the people that won’t call a lawyer and ask for help or don’t even know they can, right?

It’s like that there’s the overwhelming market share of people that they need to get after the ones that don’t know that how a lawyer can help them or that a lawyer can help them at all.

Right? So, our whole free fee guarantee.

You think for years how many lawyers are marketing contingency fee, no fee? It’s still the number one question and the

most misunderstood thing by clients is that if I don’t win your case, you owe me nothing. Nothing really. There’s not

going to be this. No, nothing. It’s still to this day the number one question and the number one concern people have. I don’t know any other

service where that says there’s no fee that actually has no fee attached. The legal industry as a whole is just so different from every other industry

because you’re selling someone on something that they don’t have to pay for it, right? 100%. But they don’t even know that they in some cases apparently don’t even have to pay.

They think they have to pay for it. And that’s why people go to the insurance company because they know, well, if I could, first of all, they think, well, why should I pay the lawyer a third? I

could do this with the insurance company direct and not pay the lawyer the third.

Not recognizing that the insurance company truly is the enemy. They are a for-profit business, which means every

dollar they pay you is a dollar less that they give to their shareholders, right? Most of them are publicly held companies. So, they have to answer for

it. So, of course, they pay you as little as they can. They lie, right? So, um in my state, for instance, you have

to pay for the person’s medical bills, whether it’s been paid by health insurance or not. You have to pay twice.

That’s the insurance company’s responsibility. And so they tell the person, “Oh, no. Well, you’re not entitled to your medical bills being paid. You have health insurance that’s

already been paid. Whereas I’m going to get you the full value of the bill. You might have a $10,000 medical bill.

Health insurance paid five. I get you the 10, they give you zero. People don’t know. That’s why you should have I mean, everybody should have a lawyer.

You’ve been running these mastermind groups. What do you say is like the biggest problem that most firms have that they come to you for advice on?” There’s a ton of different things, but

if I I was going to say the number one unified issue that I see, I’ll call it the lowhanging fruit is intake. That is the biggest problem that law firms have.

You know, lawyers, if we remove the larger law firms, right? Lawyers don’t necessarily think of their law

firm as a business, right? Which is really all it is. We’re a business that happens to be in the practice of law.

And so if you don’t run it like a business, then you’re missing a lot of pieces that you really need to tie together. And intake is that glue

between you spend all this money on marketing, right? And then you focus on the practice of law and your operation, but without intake, you don’t connect

your marketing dollars to signing cases and bringing in the firm. And there’s a lot of holes in most people’s intake center. Do you see most firms handling

intake in-house and what is the threshold by which you feel they have to handle it in-house?

I think no matter the size of your firm, you should handle intake in-house. I think that if you so for me the number there’s a million different KPIs and and

measurements and criteria that you look at in intake, but the number one measurement would be a wanted to signed ratio. meaning I spoke to you. You have a case that I want. You’re injured.

Someone else is at fault and you plan on treating. It’s really all I need to know. Like you hear some people’s intake centers. It’s like 20 minutes worth of questions. Like really? You called me.

I’m going to make you feel special. I’m going to listen to you. I’m going to have empathy. I’m going to have compassion. You were injured. Yes. Yes.

And what happened? Okay. So, someone else is at fault. Do you plan on treating? Yes. Okay. That’s it. I want your case. If I can get you to sign,

that’s my wanted to signed ratio. There is no answering service or out third-party company that is ever going

to have the wanted to sign ratio that you’re going to have internally.

What part of intake do you think is like sales as well of selling that person?

Like one is qualifying and actually doing the work of making sure that it you’re qualifying the right cases that your firm wants to sign. How much is like a sales job where you’re convincing

that person that you are the best firm for them to sign up with?

So I think if you’re an intake, you’re a salesperson. And so intake breaks down first into technology, right? So we’re

making sure when the phone call comes in that we don’t put the person on hold, that we’re answering in time, that we’re getting the call connected. So there’s a

lot of things in technology that 95% of law firms do not have set up. That’s piece one. But once you answer the

phone, you’re all you’re in sales, right? You have to have empathy, compassion, you have to listen, have to

make them feel special. And if you don’t, then your wanted to sign ratio is not going to be where it should be. My opinion, wanted to sign should be 95%.

The average firm that we talk to when we do consulting for people is between 70 and 80. And I’ve talked to firms at 50.

50%. So of every case, two cases you want, you only sign one. So I say to them, well, what’s your average fee?

Well, let’s say $10,000. So even if you’re 50 or 70 or 80%, imagine if you were at 95%.

For every case you don’t sign, it’s 10 grand literally out the window.

And that is something that you track as a KPI and your mastermind group members track as a KPI. Like that’s like the north star that everybody’s looking at.

I wish the answer to that was yes. So today in the mastermind group I presented today and I presented on intake. So one of the things I do for our mastermind members is ghost calls.

So I told you we meet weekly but we meet in person twice a year. And so we ghost call their law firm. One call during

hours, one call after hours, a form fill during hours and a form fill after hours. And we measure everything. Did you put the person on hold? How many times did you put the person on hold?

How much empathy did you have? Like a million different criteria. And so today I asked the group, how many people

know their wanted to sign ratio? And there were still some people in the group today that aren’t tracking it and don’t know it. And statistics for us,

for people we consult to, I know the average is 70 to 80%. But if you don’t know your wanted to sign ratio, it’s

actually lower cuz you’re not paying attention to it. If you don’t pay attention to something, it never goes well. How much improvement do you see firms can make before they even talk to them on the phone?

So imagine you have a receptionist and all the calls have to go through her and then you have your group over here who is going to be people who talk to

clients. So you answer the phone. Do we cheat them even how? Please hold. Cuz as a receptionist, I’m taking every call,

the vendors, the existing clients, and the small percentage of new clients because obviously that’s the smallest number of every firm, right? So

exponentially, right? No matter how big your firm is, your existing customers outnumber your new customers. And then you have your vendors, the insurance agents, the doctors, the auto body shop.

So that is a huge group of people calling and you only want to talk to your new clients and not put them on

hold. But I’m so busy as Susie at the desk barely trying to keep up with all the calls. I just treat the new client

like garbage. Whereas if you use technology, so let’s say I grab the caller ID when it comes in and I’ve connected my caller my phone system to

my case management system. So when the caller ID comes in, I scrub the case management system. If the number doesn’t exist in the case management system,

it’s a no-brainer. I know this is obviously a new client. So, it goes directly to intake. An intake never puts anyone on hold. They answer the phone,

they screen, they sign, that’s it. And then vendors, I suggest go to an IVR because they’re commercial, right?

They’re used to an IVR. And so, that’s it. They get a phone tree and they’re good. And then existing customers, same thing. It scrubs and it looks at the

status of their case. So based on the status, it routes the call to either the case manager, the lawyer, finance, whoever they need to talk to.

How do you see text messaging in your in your current process and success rate of using text messages versus phone calls?

If someone wants to chat, we do it externally. So that’s the only thing we don’t do in our intake center. We’ve tried it. We use like a pigeon and set

the whole thing up internally, but probably we could do it now because of our size, but when we tried to do it, we were smaller. And to use it effectively,

it needs to be immediate, right? When somebody messages you, they expect an instant response as if it was a phone call. And we were taking way too long.

So, we use an external company and they’re awesome. But the mistake we made is that when you’re chatting with the person, for a long time, we used to say

to the person, “Oh, we have somebody standing by. They would be happy to talk to you. Can we call you now?” And they would say yes. And so then we thought we

were connecting to them. So the company would call our law firm, an intake person would answer and connect to the person chatting. And for a long time, we

didn’t really realize that people were hanging up in that process. And so when I finally said, hey, you know, I want to look at the numbers and the statistics.

How many calls are chatting? And then we never speak to them and found we had a 50% disconnect rate from people who we say are chatting with us and we’re going

to connect you to phone, which is obvious. If you choose to text me, you don’t want to talk on the phone. And so now our policy is we sign you through

text. You text with us, we sign you through text, and we ask you what your preferred communication is. We have some clients we literally never talk to on

the phone. So we will text with them from the start of their case all the way to the end. We send them their settlement sheet, the release, everything electronic.

That’s the way to do it. I I think it’s very difficult to make someone switch channels in the preferred communication like personal like storage not working

the law firm. My lawn guy, like company, they only text me. They call me, I’m never going to answer during the workday. But if I’m in a meeting that like they shoot me a text message, I see

a pop-up, I’ll respond real quick, all my bills get sent through there, and my only way of communication is through text message. And I love that cuz it’s painless for me. Takes two seconds,

doesn’t take time out of my day, and I can do everything I need to do. Agreed.

I’ll be like, “Receive my grass, please.” They’re like, “Here’s our bill.” Who you guys use for chat? That also has alert me. Use alert.

So we use a modified contract. So our contract is enormous, right? It has all forms, Ipso, which that doesn’t really

work. So if it’s overnight and they’re handling something and they’re going to sign the person for us, it’s a simple one pager. And then when we reach out to

do the full intake with the customer, then we’ll electronically send them the larger document.

So when you’re doing that intake over text message, you’re getting the intake questions, like you said earlier, you try to keep it short and sweet, but you’re asking those basic questions where

through text and then we send you the contract electronically to your text. They sign it and it comes back like a link that’s in their text message not send email.

Exactly. And that’s a big mistake people make.

They like, “Okay, we’re gonna send you via Dax sign. What’s your email?” Yeah. No, no, no. Stay in the text. Did you have to customize that for text? Is it DocYign?

Uh, we don’t use Docu Sign. We’re using I forget the name of the company. It’s not DocYign.

But did you have to go with a specific company in order to get the text messaging?

Well, we just integrated it with Smart Advocate. So it seems like the message here is connect all your systems together data flowing

right absolutely we talk about ring central alert smart advocate docy sign or whatever the e signature platform is

domo right for all your reporting these systems do not have to live in silos that’s sort of the old way of operations right your phone system was a

hardwired phone system and your case management system that was your case management system some even had a doc management system that was separate Now the technology is so advanced that

you have the ability to just connect all these pieces together and do some of the stuff that you’re talking about. So for those of you watching, I feel like this

was like a free first mastermind class in intake and this is all what you talked about today at the mastermind session, right? 100%.

What else do you want to tell the audience about things that have worked at Rob Lavine Law that maybe make sense for other firms to start a bumping across the country outside of intake?

No, we hired you.

So, we hired you, what is this, 7 months ago or something? And you rebuilt our website and uh from there we’re building

the SEO and the videos. I think you guys did an amazing job on the branding video and yeah, you guys have been great for us. So, that’s definitely one thing. We

use Hona, so another piece of technology, right? So, Hona is automated texting. So, it integrates with any case

management system. And case management systems all generally work the same. So there’s workflows and statuses of the

case. So as the case moves through different statuses, it automatically sends a text message to the customer letting them know what’s happening,

what’s going on with their case. And I did videos. So I shot 23 videos. So we send a text and we embed the link and then the person can click on the video

and I’m talking to them telling them what’s happening now, what’s coming next. Keeps them informed. For instance, for TBI screening. So, if you’re in a in

a car accident within three days of the accident, we send you a traumatic brain injury screening checklist. So, it asks you a series of questions so we can

figure out is there a potential TBI? It automatically sends one in 2 weeks. If you marked anything that’s a yes at 3 days, so that we follow up and then if

yes at 2 weeks you have symptoms, then we’re going to get you into the right doctors. So, Hon has been great for us.

It’s great for the clients because great communication. It automates things for us. It’s been really good. Have you adopted any of these like AI tools that

are now kind of going through the legal industry? We had a client we talked to earlier today who adoptio. We talked to people who use Foundation. Are there any

of these like off-the-shelf AI platforms that you use? So I’m a part owner in Faster Outcomes, which is an AI

platform. Uh I joined them maybe four or five months ago at this point and so I’m a customer. I invest to be transparent.

I’m a customer. I invested. So, I’m a part owner and I’m now the general manager of the PI division. So, I’m building out what I see as the future

for the integration between AI and the operation of a law firm. And so, if you look at a number of the companies that

are doing AI, they really look at the endgame. So, you submit your medical records, they’ll do a demand letter and

give you a demand letter to send to the insurance company. There’s only two ways that law firms make more money. One is they hire you, right? And you increase

the number of cases that come into the law firm. So, you increase your percentage of market share. Other than that, the only way to increase the

revenue is increase the value of each case. So, I don’t care what other companies say. If at the end of the case

you draft my demand letter. So we didn’t do medical management. We didn’t figure out what’s going on with the client. We didn’t maximize their treatment. I just give you the records whether I write it

or you write it. Are you really telling me that you’re going to get me more for my case because you wrote a better demand? That’s ridiculous. Like what do

you think the insurance companies are stupid? Right? So they don’t care what you write in the demand. They’re going to look at the ICD codes. They’re going to look at the records. They’re going to look at the bills. They’re going to see what matches and their computer, right?

Colossus 20 years ago existed is going to run the numbers and figure out what the case is worth. We’re not talking about catastrophic cases, right? So just

the everyday case. So what we’re connecting or what my goal, what I envision the future is, right, is bilateral communication between the case

management system and AI. So AI, our agent, you have a professional investigator, you have an orthopedic,

you have a neurologist. They’re all your AI agents, your bots. And so as I’m doing work in the case management system, you have communication going

back and forth. So the minute I drop in the rescue report, the emergency room report, my agent is reviewing the

medical records and saying to me, I see based on the information in the medical record, this person has a potential traumatic brain injury. I think you

should send them for an evaluation to this. Which guaranteed in most law firms, first of all, case managers aren’t even reading the medical records

when they come in. They wait till the end of the case to read all the medical records because they’re too busy. They don’t have time. I don’t personally

believe we’re anywhere near AI logically thinking and being on its own, you need the human in the middle. 100% agree. Yep.

Right. But if AI has the time to read the records, it can read the record and say to me based on this, this, and this,

we should do this. Or even on the investigation, you have a slip and fall.

Okay. So based on this slip and fall, I think you should go out and send somebody to take pictures and take measurements. And then you submit that and then AI says, “Okay, based on the

codes today, here’s what I see.” AI is brilliant because it has all specific criteria and data it knows. It might not

be able to think on its own, but it can say to me, “Hey, submit this. Oh, based on what you submitted, this is what I see.”

In some firms, it makes sense. You need more cases, right? You need more leads.

You need more cases. In some firms, you got a lot of cases. How do you move them quicker? Yeah. How do you get more value out of them?

Right. I think it’s I think the things that you’re talking about are great.

This has been probably one of the most like, hey, get your notepad out.

I’ve been taking mental notes this whole time. So whether you are listening to this episode to learn about whether you should join a mastermind group or how

you should improve intake or how you should use AI in your firm, I mean, you are just chock full of information and this has been incredible. I appreciate

it, Rob. Thanks for joining. Those of you watching at home, we will catch you on the next podcast with John and Mark.

Rob Lavine, the heavy hitter. Join his mastermind group. We got to sit through it today. It was fantastic.