I wouldn’t say that a case manager or
parillegal ever sees everything there is
All right. So, welcome to the You Are
Gole Your podcast. Rob Lavine. How are
you? I’m great. How are you? I’m doing
really well. So, I’m really excited to
chat with you all about being a lawyer,
all the things that you’re doing now.
Um, and in fact, what was this
background that you wanted to show? Is
it like your business? Yeah. So we run
two businesses in the big picture, the
law firm and then Rob Lavine Legal
Solutions. And so then there’s a number
of different services under Rob Lavine
Legal Solutions. So it references the
services that we have uh on our
background. Yeah. Tell us about some of
your offerings. What do you offer with
the Rob Lavine Legal Services? Sure. So
you know I became a lawyer 25 years ago
and the law firm it’s about 260 270
people now. So and then over the years
uh we’ve created other solutions for our
law firm and then after we really tested
it and perfected it in our law firm
we’ve run them out now offering them to
others. So for instance we have a
medical record retrieval company. So
originally that was called record
retrievers. Then it was called records
on time. Now it’s under the umbrella of
Rob Lavine Legal Solutions. So our
system integrates with the law firm’s
case management system. So we integrate
with Filevine, Litify, Casepier, Smart
Advocate, Needles. We’re adding right
now Neos and Cleo. And so we continue to
add systems. And so what that means is
that we literally come into the law
firm’s case management system, scrape
their system once an hour, uh, and then
extract the provider information, the
client information, the HIPPO form. We
collect the records, and then we
literally deliver it back into the case
management system. So we deliver the
records into their document storage
system, labeled, OCRD, and compressed.
We push the expenses into their system,
the notes of what we’re doing into their
system. So it really saves them a lot of
time and money. Yeah. And you’re making
sure that everything is current and up
to date. So I love that. Absolutely.
Yeah. Okay. So first we got to
celebrate. You have 250 lawyers working
with you. That’s a huge deal. Not just
lawyers, that’s the whole team. So the
Yeah. staff is about 260. Yeah. That’s a
really big deal though. I mean that’s a
really big deal. I’m two years into
running my business, five years into
having the podcast. I was at a big law
firm for five years. So I’m like to have
people that’s huge. Where are you
located? Um I live uh between Puerto
Rico and Rhode Island and the law firm
was originally based out of Rhode
Island. Uh personal injury law we do in
Rhode Island, Mass, Connecticut, and New
Hampshire. And then we also do social
security disability and veterans
disability. And we do that nationwide,
the whole country. Okay. And so my mind
is swimming. When you first started, did
you ever think the firm would get this
big or that your services would get this
started, no, probably I did not envision
what we accomplished. Okay. So, would
you say that success kind of grew with
you or that your dreams got a little bit
bigger as like you found some success? I
mean, the goal was always to be
successful and I think in a law firm
success doesn’t necessarily mean that
you have to be big. I mean you can be
boutique and still do big cases and it
also depends on I suppose what your
definition of success is right
everybody’s definition is different so I
would say just over time uh as I learned
more got better business skills had
better ideas of what I like doing and
what I wanted to accomplish which that
has definitely changed so you just learn
Okay. All right. So, is your firm mostly
virtual or are there offices in all
these states? We have about 19 offices
um but they are mainly um just for
meeting with clients. They’re not really
uh locations where people work. We have
one location where I have team members
working out of um but the rest maybe
have 15 people in an office and the rest
is we’re 99% remote. And did that
transition happen after COVID or as you
started to scale you just were like it
makes more sense to not have happened
after COVID. So before CO the law firm
was about a hundred people uh and so
then after CO you know we’ve grown
dramatically but we also started hiring
internationally. So I have team members
now in all over the US and then we have
team members in Puerto Rico, uh,
Colombia, Peru, and the Philippines. And
so we talked about having an office
there, but it was working so well after
CO in the US to be remote. Uh, which if
you asked me before COVID, would I let
people work remote? I would have said
never. Then obviously we had to. And I
thought to myself, you know, the team
members loved it. Everybody enjoyed it.
I think people are more productive. It’s
better home life for people. So, yeah, I
would never go back to making people
work in an office. Yeah. Um, I love that
and I love to hear like a success story
postco, right? Because now you’re able
to hire the best talent even if they’re
not in Rhode Island or Massachusetts or
wherever. So, 100%. And that’s one of
the other businesses, right, that we now
offer under Rob Lavine Legal Solutions.
So, we built our own full-time academy.
So, I hired the director of training and
development from T-Mobile, actually two
people there. Uh, and then we built a
full-time academy with a learning
management system, full-time
instructors. So, we hire people in
Colombia, Peru, and then we train them
and certify them either to do intake,
legal assistants, or case managers. And
once they’re trained and they graduate
from our academy, we then place them in
other law firms. So that’s a whole other
piece of our business. All in now are
between the law firm and our other
businesses. We’re probably 600 people.
Okay. So a couple things. You started
your firm. I love that you kept your
name on all of it. I I think that part’s
great. But then also I think the the
innovation of the fact that you were
like, “Well, how big can we get?” or hey
I started to automate stuff in my office
and it worked. Let me replicate that in
other places and let me start the
academy. Right? You’re like being a
lawyer can be difficult but there’s
systems to make it easier. I want to go
teach and train. I don’t hear that very
often. A lot of lawyers want to gatekeep
their knowledge or their experience or
whatever. And so I think that’s really
commendable that you’re willing to share
it. So the third business that we offer
under Rob Leavine Legal Solutions is a
mastermind group. And so I have law
firms from all over the country that
belong. And I wouldn’t be where I am if
it wasn’t for the original mastermind
group I joined probably at this point 19
I’d say 19 years ago was probably my
first mastermind. And there were lawyers
in that group that took me under their
wing. And that’s how I learned social
security. That’s how I learned veterans
disability. And all of those things have
really worked out well for us. And so
I’m happy to share the knowledge. Right.
So there’s a ton of business to be able
to accomplish in this country and so I
don’t feel it’s necessary to gatekeep
it. I’m very successful and by sharing
with others is how I give back. Yeah.
Yeah. I love that. A lot of times people
think that they have to like work for
legal aid and like only give back, only
do social work type things or make
money. And you’re clearly showing us
that you can do both, right? I am one of
the people who do not value things if I
don’t pay for it. So, I might look at
your stuff and you be like, “Hey, free
workshop. Come learn how to run your
Because I think when you value your
stuff, other it kind of makes them want
to value it too, right? 100% agree.
Nothing we do is free. Nothing we do is
free. And so, like, even if you haven’t
left your house to spend money today,
you you’re using something that you
spent money on. I love when people don’t
shy away from it, but also when they’re
excited to make money because I’m
excited to make money. The more money
you have, the more things you can do,
but also like half of these
opportunities you probably would have
had to sit on them if you didn’t have
the money to do them, right? 100%. So,
I’m now a partner in an AI company. And
so they came to me. And so part of that
on being able to have the access to all
of the different information we have,
the things I’ve learned over the years
in PI and be able to bring that to the
AI company. Part of that is obviously
our resources. So yeah, the bigger we
get, the more options we have. I would
never say money buys happiness, but it
definitely buys options. So it gives you
opens lots of doors and gives you lots
of options. Yeah, absolutely. Okay. So,
if you don’t mind me asking, are you in
Puerto Rico now? I am. Okay. So,
audience, Rob wanted to cover his
background because he had a fancy
background and I I’m sorry you couldn’t
show it, but like I’m in Ohio recording
with you in Puerto Rico on a
Wednesday. Like, that’s kind of a flex.
That’s that’s a big deal. Yeah.
Technology is pretty cool. Yes,
absolutely. Okay. So, let’s talk a
little bit about the Rob Lavine legal
solutions. Are these solutions and
innovations that you using in your own
firm and you were like, let me outsource
them or were they things that people
started to ask for? Yeah, 100%.
Everything that we do, we started in the
firm. So we started originally we tried
using another company’s record retrieval
service and so it was a disaster and
then we decided to open our own but for
our law firm and so we ran it for our
law firm for several years and then we
decided to build a platform that we
would be able to use for other law firms
and that’s really how it took off and
then the same thing with the staffing
right so I started hiring in other
countries for me and training them
inhouse for my law firm and my record
retrieval company. And then I had
friends that said, “Hey, can you help me
with that and so we decided to turn it
into a business after we perfected it.”
Yeah. Okay. There’s a lot of strength
there in testing it and then outsourcing
it. So, you’re an enterpriser, but then
you’re almost like franchise or do you
just come in and train? Uh, as far as
the staffing and and training. Yeah. So,
we don’t really train people who already
work at a law firm. So, we train our
team members that we hire and then once
I train them and certify them, then I
place them in the law. Place them into a
law firm. So, you’re like an employment
well staffing agency. That’s what you’re
calling it. Staffing. Yes. Staffing. But
the difference is there are lots of
companies you could call uh to get
someone that you wanted international.
So, if you wanted someone in Colombia or
Peru, there’s lots of companies you
could call. We’re the only company you
could call and say, “I want a fully
trained case manager that knows how to
run a personal injury case from start to
finish.” So, our academy to be a case
manager is 12 weeks. So, it’s five days
a week, eight hours a day in a
professional environment. They have live
speaker, live trainers, they have a
learning management system. They’re
tested. So, we wash out probably 20% of
the people that start the academy don’t
graduate because they just don’t meet
our standards. Yeah. I did operations at
the law firm that I was in. And so, I
came in and people were like, “Oh,
you’re doing great. How can we get
another Kyla, but like not to replace
me, but like replicate me.” And when I
left, I was managing a department of six
parallegals. And so, I appreciate what
you’re saying because like it’s not
easy, but also when you can then deliver
and you’re like, “No, they want to do
everything.” exactly the way you already
do it. Look, they’re trained. They’re
they’re case managers. They’re
parillegals. They’re ready. There’s so
much value in that, right? And then what
is it that like a case manager would do
that is so instrumental in a law firm
versus anybody else versus just like an
associate on the team or a parallegal on
the team or whatever that you’re able to
train people internationally.
So, I mean, the the key to running the
law firm from the perspective of
bringing the most value to both the
client financially and medically is, I
would say, what’s called medical
management, right? So, there’s only two
ways for a law firm to make more money,
right? Either you bring in more cases or
you make the cases you have worth more
money. And so the key is first of all
upfront you want to do the investigation
properly. So you establish negligence
and you make sure that you have
everything you need to button that case
up and prove what you need to prove. But
then more importantly is it’s the
treatment, right? So if you don’t
medically manage your clients, our
medical system is broken, right? So the
amount of time that doctors spend with
personal injury clients is a very small
amount of time. And often you see
someone going in to see the doctor on
the first visit and then after that they
see an NP or PA who just read the
doctor’s notes on the first visit and is
kind of following a protocol. They’re
not necessarily spending the time to get
to know the client. They’re not hearing
the problems. The client’s not getting
better. They’re not necessarily ordering
the objective testing. They’re not
identifying that there’s a potential
TBI. So the case manager’s job along
with the attorney is really to make sure
that we medically manage that client.
They’re asking the doctor questions.
They’re identifying problems why they’re
not getting better. We’re getting them
to the right providers, right? After
let’s say they go to their PCP and the
PCP sends them for physical therapy. So
do they need an ortho? Do they need a
neuro? Do they need a TBI consult? What
is it they really need? So we focus on
that in the academy is making sure they
number one understand how to read the
medical records and based on what
they’re reading they know the right
questions to ask the client and really
dig deep and make sure that we’re really
pushing medical management. One because
the client needs to get better and two
that’s how you maximize the value of the
case. Okay. And there’s enough
consistency among all these cases that
you’re 12 weeks and they’re like they’ve
seen everything they could possibly see.
They’re ready. No, I wouldn’t say that a
case manager or parillegal ever sees
everything there is to see. In the month
of April, we opened a thousand cases.
And so when you’re doing that kind of
volume, there’s no way even at that
volume that you get to see everything
because there’s always different
nuances. There’s always crazy stories,
crazy accidents, bizarre injuries. And
so, but I would say in 12 weeks, we’ve
done a great job of instilling the
basics, right? So, now they truly
understand how to run a case. They
understand leans. They understand health
insurance. They understand medical
management. They understand demands,
records, they understand the settlement
process. So, they can go into an office
and truly function. And then it’s on the
office to continue to mentor and manage
that person and coach them and bring
them along. It probably takes someone a
good year if you ask my opinion to
really know what you’re doing and do the
job really well. After a year, if you’re
doing volume, right, if you’re getting
enough cases on a regular basis, you
know, let’s say you have a case load of
100 100 cases of your own and so then
yeah, that you’re should be in good
shape. But, you know, you’re still
learning. I’ve been doing this 25 years.
I still learn stuff all the time. Yeah.
Okay. And then I know every office calls
these things different titles, right?
When I was working at the law firm, I
was called an enforcement coordinator
and I was completely the director of
operations. So what other titles have
you heard that called? Like in law
firms, I would say a case manager and a
parallegal are are generally
interchangeable, right? And so what
we’re talking about is pre-litigation.
So we really train them to do the
pre-litigation process. They’re not in
12 weeks trained in lit. So, a
litigation parallegal is different than
a litigation parallegal. And most
litigation parallegals don’t even know
how to do the pre-lit job. Like they
don’t know how to build a case from day
one, right? And how to handle the
treatment and how to get the records and
how to do the demand. They’re used to
litigation, right? So, they know how to
help with the complaint, how to help
with discovery, the interrogatories,
requests for production, all of those
pieces that build that case up to
building a trial notebook. And so
totally different skill set. Yeah. Yeah.
Okay. So Rob, before law school, what
made you decide to go? Had you been
So I started at 16 years old as a EMT. I
volunteered on a rescue squad and then I
went into the Rhode Island National
Guard and I was a military police
officer. Then I went to college for
criminal justice and then I was a police
officer. So, I was a police officer in a
small city in Rhode Island. And at the
time, the law was if you were a police
officer, they had to pay for your
bachelor’s, masters, and law degree. So,
I already had my bachelor’s in criminal
justice. Um, and my goal was to be a
fed. That’s really what I wanted was DEA
or FBI, something like that. And so I
started going to law school because I
thought having my law degree and having
the law enforcement background would
make it easy for me to become a fed. And
then six, seven years in, uh, I got into
a very bad car accident while I was
working as a police officer. Uh, woman
pulled out in front of me while I was
responding with lights and sirens. Big
impact. The two of us went into a
building. Uh, and I was in therapy for a
year. And at the end of the year, the
three independent doctors said I had to
retire. Uh my career was over.
So at that point, I took the bar. Well,
I finished law school, took the bar, and
began the next stage or next phase of my
life. Wow. The rest is history.
Pretty much. Okay. Well, I’m glad that
you are um doing better. That sound that
accident sounds absolutely terrifying.
Um, so I love that that wasn’t the end
of your story. You were like, “No,
there’s there’s more. Okay, I can’t do
that. There’s always more.” Yeah. Okay.
All right. Cool. So, this podcast is all
about humanizing lawyers. All the stuff
we do outside of the courtroom or
outside of our jobs, but also it’s
advice to younger lawyers. So, Rob, what
would you say to a young lawyer five
years practicing or less about what they
could do with their law degree?
So I mean I think in today’s world the
it’s limitless right? So if I had to
give advice whether it was to a lawyer
or anyone starting out in any career
it’s about finding your passion right so
we spend more time working than we do
anything else in life. You spend more
time working than you are with your kids
than you are with your spouse than you
are on your hobbies. So you have to
enjoy what you do if you want it to be
meaningful and you want to be able to,
you know, really change your life. So
that’s what is always going to be my
first piece of advice. Make sure you
love what you do. Make sure you’re
passionate about it and then grow it.
Yeah, grow it. And growing it includes
keep going and innovate because I feel
like growing it growing it means a
million different things to a million
different people, right? So everybody
has a different definition as we started
out as success, right? So I know lawyers
who are very successful that do one very
specific area of law, very boutique.
They only take a certain type of cases,
certain size cases, and they’re very
happy. I knew other lawyers that want to
be a bohemoth. They do a ton of
different things and they take it all
in. So it really just depends what’s
important to you. Like so part of what’s
important to us at our law firm is
giving back. for instance. So, we give a
lot back to the community. We have a an
event every year where we have a family
fun day. So, we take over a park. We
give backpacks to the kids. We give out
bike helmets. We give out all sorts of
things. And we have um clowns there and
musicians and and food. Uh we do seven
holidays a year. We we give out free
rides to prevent drunk driving. So,
we’ve built an app that literally
downloads a certificate into your phone
and uploads it into your Uber app. Uh,
so you can get a free ride home to
prevent drunk driving. I mean, you know,
the like I said, money gives you
options. So, for me, one of those things
is to give back to the community. Yeah.
So, I like that Uber idea. That’s great.
I think it does tie into your mission,
you know, with you teaching and
training, but also just supporting the
community. And like do you guys do auto
accident cases? You said personal
injury. Yeah, of course. So then that
still reinforces that too. It’s like we
don’t want you to be a client from that
perspective here. I I love it. I think
that’s very smart. Right. Thank you.
cool. All right, Rob. Well, thank you so
much for joining the You Are Lawyer
podcast. Thank you. Thank you so much.
